The handwriting was on the wall then. There was a new group of "lean and mean" loan originators pushing sub-prime loans even then (in the late 90's).
In those days you filled out a mortgage application, provided your tax returns and gave permission for the company to verify your information. Your file was a quarter of an inch thick.
Then the Processor went to work. S/He began sending out VOEs, VOIs, VORs, that is, Verifications of Employment, Income, Rent. S/He requested verifications of EVERYTHING, and they did so diligently ... it was their job. By the time the Processor was done, your file was about one inch thick.
Then the Underwriter went to work and reviewed everything the Processor had done for validity, and rationality that you had the income, your income was stable and fell into a livable range should you be granted the mortgage. Maybe the the Underwriter approved your loan.
Then the Closer went to work. S/He produced the documents to be signed at closing and coordinated with the Closing Agent who actually met you and had you sign the papers and verified that there was valid title to be passed. The Closing Agent was then responsible to see that the appropriate documents were recorded with the local Clerk of Court. During that period Secondary Marketing was very likely in the process of selling your loan to a large purchaser such as B of A or Citi or ... er ... Countrywide.
When you were through signing the papers your file was at least two inches thick, maybe three. The file folder holding all those documents (the order being VERY stringently required) went to the ultimate purchaser of your loan. That file folder was then THE mortgage ... it was bundled with a number of similar files by interest rate and term to approximate $1 Million dollars, plus or minus $25,000. THAT bundle of files became a bond. It was then peddled on Wall Street as a (let's say) 30 year security.
Picture it. Ten files, each three inches thick worth One Million Dollars. The documents within each of those files ARE the ASSET you the bond purchaser buys. Now ... picture what it would be like to discover that the Verification of Income wasn't there or was fraudulent for a substantial portion of the files in that Thirty inch thick bundle of files you owned and paid $1 Million for.
You just might be pissed to find that out. If you were the person living in one of the ten houses represented by that bond and you discovered that the Note you signed may have been sold to more than one bond holder, you might be pissed too.
In short ... All bets are off. I suspect things are not as dire as I just implied. But, until there is clarity and transparency ... All bets are off. This will likely shake out fine in 95% of cases ... but, right now ... ALL BETS ARE OFF.
First, I want to say I WIN. I live in a foreclosed home which I inherited from my father. Not my loan, but now MY HOUSE. Thank you Angelo Mozillo (Cuntrywide mtg, now owned by BofA)
Jesus, I thought ZH people had brains. First, 23 states means those states which have laws requiring judicial foreclosure. The rest of the states, you don't need to go through a court to foreclose.
Now, for those of you who think this is no big deal or was planned by the banks, PLEASE GET A LIFE! The only way this was planned was if it came from the very, very top of the food chain, like the people who run the White House (please, Obama really has no power. He's a puppet to the MONEY). There is also no good way out of this for any of the following: The banks, the investors, the municipalities in which the properties are located who are getting no property tax payments, the courts (completely overwhelmed - prepare to see many long-standing judges retire because they don't need the headaches), the American banking system, the Federal Reserve, the federal government. What will be standing at the end of all of this are the states - the backbone of the nation. The feds can do much, but they cannot change state banking laws.
Everybody is screwed by this. Winners include homeowners who stopped paying mortgages, some very few, very smart real estate speculators (there's money to be made here, but it's a bitch to get to it and may take years before profits are realized).
Further, this is the blackest black swan ever. BofA, now the third bank to admit fraud, holds the largest number of mortgages, because they took over Cuntrywide. They are Fu**ed, fu**ed, fu**ed royally. It will literally take years (think 3 to 5 to 7) for all of this to get through the courts. The banks will not even prosecute in most cases because the costs are so high and the risks so great.
Now, the investors, who are they? Little towns in Sweden, other municipalities in the US. Some credit unions, some rich guys in Malaysia, they are spread all over the world. The investors will be taking hits of magnificent proportions. Huge, enormous calamity with great deals of money being eviscerated.
BofA is the crow in the coal mine - not a canary, because they are so big. BofA is NOT TBIF and are already planning their glidepath to bankruptcy. They've been insovent since having (note they were forced by the govt. and the Fed - Paulson) to take over Cuntrywide and Merrill Lynch. Both bankrupt entities.
They're dead, just nobody knows it yet. If the stock market doesn't crash before the midterms, then something is seriously wrong and the people need to rise up and throw all of the fuckers out because this is the end. There was fraud on the front end and now fraud on the back end. If the USA avoids going into martial law, I will be surprised.
Now, I don't normally do this because I don't like treading on other people's turf, but I am going to link to my last two entries on my MoneyDaily blog. Mind you, I try to write things so the average joe or jane can understand and have been diligent, writing daily for the past 3 1/2 years.
These two articles should give you some background and the links lead to places with more info. I've been following this story for 3 years and lately with more interest because I have a vested interest ($80,000 home which I may end up owning free and clear) Here goes:
Should American Homeowners Stop Paying Mortgages?
and today
Mortgage, Foreclosure Mess Broadens, Deepens
BBC - BBC Comedy Blog: Impersonating The <b>News</b> Quiz
Funny stuff from the heart of the BBC Comedy Department.
After <b>news</b> of Google tax dodges, Obama raises money with Google <b>...</b>
Google, according to a report by Bloomberg News, has used paper transactions to shift $3.1 billion of its income to Bermuda and other low-tax havens in recent years. The company's aggressive use of such tax dodges has reduced its ...
BREAKING <b>NEWS</b>: No Jail For Lindsay Lohan - Judge Orders Her To <b>...</b>
http://link.brightcove.com/services/link/bcpid16157557001/bctid645210306001 Lindsay Lohan caught a major break on Friday when Judge Elden Fox chose not to send her to jail and ordered her to stay in rehab at the Betty Ford Center.
eric seiger eric seiger
The handwriting was on the wall then. There was a new group of "lean and mean" loan originators pushing sub-prime loans even then (in the late 90's).
In those days you filled out a mortgage application, provided your tax returns and gave permission for the company to verify your information. Your file was a quarter of an inch thick.
Then the Processor went to work. S/He began sending out VOEs, VOIs, VORs, that is, Verifications of Employment, Income, Rent. S/He requested verifications of EVERYTHING, and they did so diligently ... it was their job. By the time the Processor was done, your file was about one inch thick.
Then the Underwriter went to work and reviewed everything the Processor had done for validity, and rationality that you had the income, your income was stable and fell into a livable range should you be granted the mortgage. Maybe the the Underwriter approved your loan.
Then the Closer went to work. S/He produced the documents to be signed at closing and coordinated with the Closing Agent who actually met you and had you sign the papers and verified that there was valid title to be passed. The Closing Agent was then responsible to see that the appropriate documents were recorded with the local Clerk of Court. During that period Secondary Marketing was very likely in the process of selling your loan to a large purchaser such as B of A or Citi or ... er ... Countrywide.
When you were through signing the papers your file was at least two inches thick, maybe three. The file folder holding all those documents (the order being VERY stringently required) went to the ultimate purchaser of your loan. That file folder was then THE mortgage ... it was bundled with a number of similar files by interest rate and term to approximate $1 Million dollars, plus or minus $25,000. THAT bundle of files became a bond. It was then peddled on Wall Street as a (let's say) 30 year security.
Picture it. Ten files, each three inches thick worth One Million Dollars. The documents within each of those files ARE the ASSET you the bond purchaser buys. Now ... picture what it would be like to discover that the Verification of Income wasn't there or was fraudulent for a substantial portion of the files in that Thirty inch thick bundle of files you owned and paid $1 Million for.
You just might be pissed to find that out. If you were the person living in one of the ten houses represented by that bond and you discovered that the Note you signed may have been sold to more than one bond holder, you might be pissed too.
In short ... All bets are off. I suspect things are not as dire as I just implied. But, until there is clarity and transparency ... All bets are off. This will likely shake out fine in 95% of cases ... but, right now ... ALL BETS ARE OFF.
First, I want to say I WIN. I live in a foreclosed home which I inherited from my father. Not my loan, but now MY HOUSE. Thank you Angelo Mozillo (Cuntrywide mtg, now owned by BofA)
Jesus, I thought ZH people had brains. First, 23 states means those states which have laws requiring judicial foreclosure. The rest of the states, you don't need to go through a court to foreclose.
Now, for those of you who think this is no big deal or was planned by the banks, PLEASE GET A LIFE! The only way this was planned was if it came from the very, very top of the food chain, like the people who run the White House (please, Obama really has no power. He's a puppet to the MONEY). There is also no good way out of this for any of the following: The banks, the investors, the municipalities in which the properties are located who are getting no property tax payments, the courts (completely overwhelmed - prepare to see many long-standing judges retire because they don't need the headaches), the American banking system, the Federal Reserve, the federal government. What will be standing at the end of all of this are the states - the backbone of the nation. The feds can do much, but they cannot change state banking laws.
Everybody is screwed by this. Winners include homeowners who stopped paying mortgages, some very few, very smart real estate speculators (there's money to be made here, but it's a bitch to get to it and may take years before profits are realized).
Further, this is the blackest black swan ever. BofA, now the third bank to admit fraud, holds the largest number of mortgages, because they took over Cuntrywide. They are Fu**ed, fu**ed, fu**ed royally. It will literally take years (think 3 to 5 to 7) for all of this to get through the courts. The banks will not even prosecute in most cases because the costs are so high and the risks so great.
Now, the investors, who are they? Little towns in Sweden, other municipalities in the US. Some credit unions, some rich guys in Malaysia, they are spread all over the world. The investors will be taking hits of magnificent proportions. Huge, enormous calamity with great deals of money being eviscerated.
BofA is the crow in the coal mine - not a canary, because they are so big. BofA is NOT TBIF and are already planning their glidepath to bankruptcy. They've been insovent since having (note they were forced by the govt. and the Fed - Paulson) to take over Cuntrywide and Merrill Lynch. Both bankrupt entities.
They're dead, just nobody knows it yet. If the stock market doesn't crash before the midterms, then something is seriously wrong and the people need to rise up and throw all of the fuckers out because this is the end. There was fraud on the front end and now fraud on the back end. If the USA avoids going into martial law, I will be surprised.
Now, I don't normally do this because I don't like treading on other people's turf, but I am going to link to my last two entries on my MoneyDaily blog. Mind you, I try to write things so the average joe or jane can understand and have been diligent, writing daily for the past 3 1/2 years.
These two articles should give you some background and the links lead to places with more info. I've been following this story for 3 years and lately with more interest because I have a vested interest ($80,000 home which I may end up owning free and clear) Here goes:
Should American Homeowners Stop Paying Mortgages?
and today
Mortgage, Foreclosure Mess Broadens, Deepens
BBC - BBC Comedy Blog: Impersonating The <b>News</b> Quiz
Funny stuff from the heart of the BBC Comedy Department.
After <b>news</b> of Google tax dodges, Obama raises money with Google <b>...</b>
Google, according to a report by Bloomberg News, has used paper transactions to shift $3.1 billion of its income to Bermuda and other low-tax havens in recent years. The company's aggressive use of such tax dodges has reduced its ...
BREAKING <b>NEWS</b>: No Jail For Lindsay Lohan - Judge Orders Her To <b>...</b>
http://link.brightcove.com/services/link/bcpid16157557001/bctid645210306001 Lindsay Lohan caught a major break on Friday when Judge Elden Fox chose not to send her to jail and ordered her to stay in rehab at the Betty Ford Center.
eric seiger eric seiger
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